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| Author: | paso750 [ Thu May 01, 2008 11:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | gear shifting rod length |
the one connecting gear shifting lever and shifting lever of the engine. Could someone do me a favour and measure its length from bolt to bolt ? It`s adjustible and I disassembled mine to clean it and to change the end parts. thx G. |
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| Author: | Skins [ Fri May 02, 2008 7:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: gear shifting rod length |
 Gerhard, the length of the tube is 18cm. Is that what you wanted to know? My linkage rod, from pedal pivot to front pivot, is different to the original length because I turned the front part of the linkage assembly upsidedown to give me one-up-and-four-down shifting, and adjusted the length of the rod for a good action. |
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| Author: | ducapaso [ Sun May 04, 2008 4:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: gear shifting rod length |
240 mm eye to eye on my duckess... I suppose it's never been changed, even if i'm thinkig that a lowered lever would be helpful... |
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| Author: | paso750 [ Sun May 04, 2008 6:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: gear shifting rod length |
thanks, I just needed an indication to start off with. I will also lower the shifter a bit as I sometimes have problems to shift in higher gears. Skins, why do you reverse shift ?! G. |
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| Author: | Skins [ Mon May 05, 2008 1:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: gear shifting rod length |
| I reversed the shift on both my bikes (the other is a Honda GB400) because I believe, as do many competition riders, that it's better that way. To many competition riders, up for first and down for the rest probably just 'feels' better, but I think there is a rational explanation for it, as I wrote in a previous post a year or so ago, and which I have copied here: CHANGING FOR THE BETTER Paso owners are fortunate in being able to correct what I believe is a modern motorcycle design faux pas – the gears shift in the wrong direction. But on a Paso, it’s very easy to reverse the gear shift action for better and safer riding. It can be done in minutes. There are two parts to this subject – the foot and the pedal, and riding technique. In the first part I look at how the foot works and how the pedal works, and in the second part I show how this relates to riding technique. First, the foot: Imagine sitting in your car. Try to imagine controlling the accelerator not by pushing down on the pedal, but instead by hooking your foot under the pedal and pulling it up. Doesn’t make much sense, does it? If you could control your car’s pedals better by pulling them up with your foot, they’d make the pedals that way. The human foot is able to control downward pressure very precisely, using the ball of the foot. You don’t have to imagine driving your car to realise this – just think about it next time you’re standing up or walking around. That’s why the ball of the foot is so good at downward pressure – we evolved to spend a lot of time standing and walking around, even if we seem to be doing it less and less these days. About the only thing I can think of that upward pressure of the foot is good for is kicking footballs, which doesn’t have a lot to do with motorcycling. OK. So if one wants to move something very precisely with the foot, it is better to push down on it with the ball of the foot than to pull it up with the top of the foot. Now, the pedal: As far as the pedal is concerned, we can ask two things – why is it on the left, and why is it arranged these days so that we have to push it down for first, and then pull it up for the rest of the gears? It is on the left because during the seventies manufacturers around the world decided they had better start putting it there because that was where the US Government said it had to be, and they wanted to sell bikes in the US. Whether the US Government made a law about pushing it down for first, I don’t know, but maybe Harleys and Indians changed gears that way, and everybody copied them, or maybe everybody copied Triumph. Anyway, it doesn’t make much difference which side the pedal is, but it makes a lot of difference whether first is down and the rest up, or first is up and the rest down. Obviously the manufacturers wanted uniformity – unfortunately they just picked the wrong way. Well, that’s what I believe (and so do certain other people, as we shall see) and that’s why I have changed my shift to up for first and down for the rest, and why I hope to convince you to do the same. It’s really easy to do on a Paso – all you have to do is take the front part of the gear change linkage off the shaft and put it back on the other way up, and then adjust the link rod for a good pedal position and shift action. You don’t even have to remove the fairing. It takes only a few minutes. Now, the second part, riding technique: This is where things get serious. Let’s consider how changing to a higher gear is different from changing to a lower gear. The most obvious difference is that changing to a higher gear – say from second to third, has a braking effect on the engine, and the revs will drop, while changing to a lower gear –say from third to second, has a braking effect on the back wheel, and the engine revs will rise. However, there are two other differences which are much more important. Firstly, the change to a higher gear – say from second to third, or third to fourth, can be made very quickly – in a fraction of a second with a good set-up if you know what you’re doing, while the change to a lower gear – say from third to second, takes a lot longer – pull in the clutch, rev her up, and slip her into gear as the revs drop. Of course you have more time available to make the change to a lower gear - as you decelerate for the corner, traffic, or whatever - but it’s good to make the change to the higher gear quickly, so you don’t lose time and momentum when you’re accelerating. Secondly, and most importantly, missing a change to a higher gear is likely to have very different consequences compared to missing a change to a lower gear. Changing to a higher gear – say third to fourth, you’ll be accelerating, and, especially if you’re in a corner, you’ll need that power for control. Also, you’ll be gassing it, maybe very hard, and if you miss the change you will almost certainly over-rev the motor, or damage the gearbox. Missing a change to a lower gear – say third to second, you’ll probably just find yourself coasting, on a small throttle opening, everything peaceful and quiet, as you contemplate a little extra braking. You might even have a couple of fingers already on the brake lever. Also, when changing to a higher gear, you will feel the gear going in better, even through the sole of your boot, with the precise and sensitive ball of your foot. So: If you’re going to miss a change, make it a change to a lower gear, not a higher gear. OK, to sum up:- On those high-action up changes – second to third, third to fourth, you should be using that skillful, precise ball of your foot (maybe ‘football’ has something to do with motorcycling after all) to make sure you get it right, while those leisurely down changes can be entrusted to the top of your foot. And, if you want to see people who really do know what it’s all about using ‘up for first and down for the rest’, watch closely next time you see MotoGP or SBK on your screen. |
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| Author: | Duc750 [ Sun Jun 22, 2008 7:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: gear shifting rod length |
SKins You don't believe the traditional simple explanation then ? That when entering a left hand corner you get better ground clearance as your foot can be above the lever anticiapting the up shift rather than the under the lever? |
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| Author: | Skins [ Sun Jun 22, 2008 8:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: gear shifting rod length |
| No, I don't - I think it's nonsense. What you want from the motor, and which gear you want, is always changing, within reason, whether you're upright, banked to the left, or banked to the right. There is another member, Michael Delage (username 'delagem') who feels as I do and who has also reversed the shift pattern on his bikes. He speaks about it in the sixth entry down in the topic 'Clunky Downshift' > viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1140&p=7661&hilit=clunky+downshift#p7661 < However, if you asked Rossi or Stoner why they use it, I reckon they'd say something like "We just do, we always have". But it really is an interesting question, I think, and every time I ride one of my bikes, I'm glad I use it. And reversing the pattern on a Paso really is so easy to do - a five-minute job - if you want to try it. |
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| Author: | Duc750 [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 7:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: gear shifting rod length |
Skins I've always used reverse shift on the track but never on the road. The only reason I have ever ever used is the amount of left toe sliders I've gone through from having my foot under the shifter on left hand exits! (big feet and badly aligned lower legs means that I have a sticky outy toe issue !  )The big problem with most production bike gear shifts is the quality of the linkage assembly - Ducati are I think the exception to this as the joints are good quality in the shift linkage and the rod is a decent diameter unlike some of the cr@p pushed out on Jap bikes. This creates a lot of slack and therefore a sloppy shift - with a decent shift rod and linkage assembly shifts using a road pattern are fine IMHO The simple reason for using road pattern on the road is that I swop bikes quite a lot with friends when we are out and that leads to far fewer "interesting" moments for them and me ! |
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| Author: | Skins [ Mon Jun 23, 2008 8:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: gear shifting rod length |
| Fair enough. I can certainly agree with your last comment: I use a reversed shift on my bikes because I hardly ever ride any other machinery. And when I've discussed the matter with other riders, (usually blokes in the motorcycle industry but riding mostly on the street) they've also said they wouldn't use a reversed pattern on their own bikes mainly because they ride so many different bikes. But for Paso riders who ride their Pasos most of the time, I reckon it's worth a try, because the change is so easy to make, much easier than on some other models, like the 916 and so on. |
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| Author: | ducapaso [ Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:31 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: gear shifting rod length |
THe only risk you can hazard if you ride both standard shifting and reverse ones is to make a mistake! My nephew happened this and shifted 3->2 believing to do 3->4, at top engine rpm! Crankshaft bent. 
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| Author: | Duc750 [ Tue Jun 24, 2008 10:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: gear shifting rod length |
I guess the only reason I don't do this is my riding on the road is VERY different to the track 
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